[tigerbacon]

Hi, I'm trying to figure out the optimal tapers for "Precise" branded 0.75 bands for a hunting setup.
Right now I'm using a 20/15mm taper doubled up with Theraband Red 20/15mm(very roughly).
My draw length is 30" and my active length is 6".

What steps can I take to get the power of my current setup but with 1 band set (instead of doubling up with Theraband Red)?
Should I be making the cuts wider?
Shortening the active length?

My newbie brain has no clue. Thanks!

http://imgur.com/6lbQQPd

 

[Grandpa Grumpy]

Have you tried the precise bands with the 20/15mm taper alone? You might be surprised. Often times when you double bands you don't gain much power only heavier draw weight.

 

[tigerbacon]

Have you tried the precise bands with the 20/15mm taper alone? You might be surprised. Often times when you double bands you don't gain much power only heavier draw weight.

Hey, yeah I was shooting with 20/15 alone for two weeks and it didn't have quite as much of an impact as when doubled up with TB Red. Doubled up with Red it's pretty punchy, but that's a given eh.

 

[urbanshooter]

There has been comparisons done that pretty much confirms doubling up isn't a great idea anymore. The power gain vs the draw weight increase is just not worth it. To put it in very simplified terms, power gain doesn't double but draw weight pretty much does. So, there are better options for power gain. You can simply cut wider or just use a single heavier band-sets. When starting out in this hobby, we all go through a bit of a power hungry phase but soon realise that power isn't everything. When there is enough power, it's enough. A well placed shot is adequate for appropriate game. Also, overpowered band-sets don't last very long either.

With rubber these days, 20 mm is plenty. How aggressively you taper is really up to you. Can't really tell you what an "optimum" is because that depends on the feel, performance and longevity an individual prefers. Just note that aggressive tapers will reduce band-set longevity though some taper is always recommended because if nothing else, it encourages breaks at the pouch end (and that will eventually happen). 20/15 is a popular set-up. Maybe you can adjust from there and see where you want to go.

If your frame accommodates wider bands, you can always cut wider for more power, though again, we would caution against overpowered band-sets but if you do need that power for heavy projectiles, then go for it...

Just make sure your draw length is correct, and measure out your bandsets so you get near to, but not at, the elongation maximum at the top of your draw. If you don't max out your elongation, your band-sets will last longer. Another way to get more power is with a longer draw length. Shooting with a 3/4 floating anchor or butterfly/albatross will give you harder hitting impacts with the same projectile though the band-sets will have to be adjusted accordingly for the extended draw lengths.

Play around a little with tapers and you will eventually find your own favourite set-ups. Note also that rubber is not all the same and some require longer cut lengths than others. Give Precise, Sumeike, or GZK a try, you might be pleasantly surprised.

Enjoy the discovery ...and welcome to the forum.

 

[31610]

:yeahthat:

 

[MakoPat]

Yeah, what Port Boy said that Urbanshooter said...

Also did I miss it...
what is your ammo size/weight?

 

[tigerbacon]

Thanks for the in-depth reply urbanshooter!
The Precise has definitely been better than TBG so far and I look forward to trying the other brands as well.

So it seems if I want to shoot 0.75 Precise at 20/15 without doubling up with Theraband Red, I should try increasing my draw to floating or butterfly draw?
Or possibly increase the 20/15 slightly?

I'm currently shooting 9mm steel.

 

[urbanshooter]

Thanks for the in-depth reply urbanshooter!
The Precise has definitely been better than TBG so far and I look forward to trying the other brands as well.

So it seems if I want to shoot 0.75 Precise at 20/15 without doubling up with Theraband Red, I should try increasing my draw to floating or butterfly draw?
Or possibly increase the 20/15 slightly?

I'm currently shooting 9mm steel.

0.75 Precise is plenty of rubber for 9 mm steel and 20/15 setup should be adequate. However, if you are still hungry for more power, I suppose you could increase to 22 and taper to your liking; or you can shoot 8 mm steel and get faster projectile speeds with the same set-up.

If you haven't come across it already, look up "KalevalaSlingshot" on Youtube. He posts videos of different elastics. If I am not mistaken, he seems to favour 20/15 and 8 mm steel. There is also one where he tests the 1.0 mm GZK and for that he went down to 15/10 for 9.5 mm steel. Kalevala also shows chrony results so we get a pretty good indication of band performance.

Also, it's not a good idea to pair different rubber on double-ups as they stretch at different rates. And yes, shooting with a longer draw will increase power. Very simply, more rubber for a gven projectile equals more power. Longer draw equals more rubber (because you'll need to cut longer bandsets); heavier bandset also equals more rubber and so too would wider tapers...

Again, we would caution that overpowered band-sets don't last well and it's almost as bad as dry firing which will rapidly lead to the demise of your band-sets. Power isn't everything - the last world championship was won using 0.45 bands. Having said that, most of us would use different set-ups for different situations and ammo. I keep a variety of frames with different set-ups ready for different uses. The point is to always sensibly match the band-set to the ammo.

Oh, one more thing, the pouch should be minimal and lightweight if you are really going all out to maximise the power of a band-set.

Have fun!

 

[Kalevala]

Can't really tell you what an "optimum" is because that depends on the feel, performance and longevity an individual prefers.

Play around a little with tapers and you will eventually find your own favourite set-ups. Note also that rubber is not all the same and some require longer cut lengths than others.

Enjoy the discovery ...and welcome to the forum.

:yeahthat:

Lately I have been shooting mostly 8 mm steel and 20-15 tapered is very good with 0,6 thick.

If You use 0,7 You can shoot 9,5 mm steel too (enough speed to card cut) and if taper is 20-10,

it's great with 8 mm but not perfect with 9,5 mm steel.

Here is speedtest with Precise 0,75 2nd gen. (12,5-10)

 

[Kalevala]

it didn't have quite as much of an impact

Is this just a feeling, when pulling bands or result of penetration test ?

 

[tigerbacon]

Also, it's not a good idea to pair different rubber on double-ups as they stretch at different rates. And yes, shooting with a longer draw will increase power. Very simply, more rubber for a gven projectile equals more power. Longer draw equals more rubber (because you'll need to cut longer bandsets); heavier bandset also equals more rubber and so too would wider tapers...

Ah, good point on pairing different rubbers. I promptly removed the red bands from the set, heh.

it didn't have quite as much of an impact

Is this just a feeling, when pulling bands or result of penetration test ?

Hey! Thanks for all those videos you put up btw. It helped me decide on purchasing the Precise bands a while back.

I was shooting a leather spinner and a can at 18m with 2 sets of bands:
1) was just Precise 20/15
2) Precise 20/15 doubled up with Theraband Red

When I switched over to the second set the leather spinner seemed to have received more power in the impact because it visually and audibly sounded stronger.
Both bands penetrate cans though. My main priority is to make sure I have the optimal amount of impact to take down game...without having to go full butterfly just yet lol.
I'm going to try and add an inch to my active length to start and not double up bands.

 

[Kalevala]

If Your cans were made of aluminium ( I suppose so), it's not wery good display of power.

 

[tigerbacon]

So I increased my draw length for the 20/15 and I'm making sure to pivot the fork forward for extra power and it seems to be having a good impact.
Thanks everyone for your insights!
I'm going to keep experimenting with it but I'm glad I don't have to double up.