[Soske]

Obviously tubes are slower then flats, but why is that?? Reduced retraction speed due to the thick walls?

If that's the case why could you not make a tube with say, .7 walls would that not be the best of both worlds? (Except you could not cut tapers)

And why the high draw weight of tubes?, my looped 1632s have a way higher draw weight then my tapered precise .75s (and 1632 walls are pretty thin) but the .75 shoots quite a bit faster?

I dunno, just the questions that keep me up nights

 

[mattwalt]

Do they?

Think the logic is for the same cross section area and the same rubber performance should be about the same.

Comparing a taper to a tube would be illogical as tapers perform better generally - tube would essentially be a straight cut. Though its possible a tube could have a little more friction in the setup.

Also higher performing rubber compared to tubes is again a little unfair on the poor tubes - Would be nice to see tubes in Precise etc.

Where tubes really shine for me is consistency - no having to faff cutting bands to exact measurements and more importantly durability - they simply last ages.

 

[Tag]

Mattwalt said it perfectly for me

 

[MakoPat]

So? Flat tapers are faster than tubes with lower deaw weight IF we're talking about outcomes.

Tubes, straight cuts, and tapers all have pros and cons.

Tubes are durable, easier to make sets,and less fiddly... but they are not as snappy/fast and have heavier draw weight.

Flat bands, either straight or tapered, are fast with less draw weight, BUT wear faster, are fiddlier when shooting, and require more wffort to make sets.

Every system has strength and weaknesses... different inputs for different desired outcomes.

Some folks plink and walk about...
Some folks feel the need for speed...
Some folks want uber precision at distance...
Some folks want to shoot many shots in the least span of time.

 

[vince4242]

I think the question of speed is only relevant if you're hunting or long distance shooting. Again has said tubes will last 1200 to 1500 shots or more. My 1632 tubes start getting a little bit weak after about 1500 shots I just have to trim down about half an inch off the end and they get their snap right back and last another good five or six hundred shots before I retire them. I am only shooting ¼" and clay with them but can't beat several months on the same band.

I shoot .6 bands for hunting and it is fast as heck but in general I shoot Spinners most of the time and you don't need anything faster than a flat trajectory at a certain distance to make a spinner flip. Shooting at 300 feet per second does the exact same thing as hitting it at 200 feet per second against a spinner.

Cheers

 

[Soske]

My 1632s do have the higher draw weight not by all that much but they do, they are very stiff 1632s I found on ebay much stiffer then the regular ones

 

[Soske]

I guess it probably comes down to elongation and tapering. I feel comfortable stretching the tubes further knowing they won't tear for awhile, which results in higher draw weight and the tapering just makes the flats super fast, and of course the rubber is better

 

[mattwalt]

I almost exclusively shoot with tubes. Its the durability which is the main reason I stick with them - I've had sets last well over 2000 shots

Also they'll do everything you'd ever need them too.

 

[Winnie]

A rifle will shoot the same load faster than a pistol. The bullet is being pushed for a longer time down the longer barrel and the velocity increases as a result.

I think of a tapered band being like a rifle barrel. Instead of a hard snap like an un-tapered band or a tube, what you get instead is a constant acceleration as the different widths of the bands work to pull continuously throughout the shortening process.

 

[Soske]

I used to shoot single 2040 tubes exclusively, thought would never go back to flatbands....but I like to go for walks and shoot targets of opportunity usually rocks in the creeks and stumps, at all distances. I found the holdover needed was making accuracy hard. I needed a flatter tregectory to hit targets at varying distances. Then I bought a frame I liked that had thumb screw clips, breaking bands was not such a pain anymore. It came with a nice bandset made from good rubber. After that it was hard to go back to tubes. I started shooting short draw again. Buying pre made bandsets from ebay for less then I could buy tubes. Who cares if they break if I can just replace them in thirty seconds? But that did not last long. Short draw feels so limiting when I have been used to the power and speed of full butterfly draw. But tubes seemed to slow now. So I started making tapered butterfly bands with modern rubber, it's hard to go back now.....

 

[Facewizard13]

I used to shoot single 2040 tubes exclusively, thought would never go back to flatbands....but I like to go for walks and shoot targets of opportunity usually rocks in the creeks and stumps, at all distances. I found the holdover needed was making accuracy hard. I needed a flatter tregectory to hit targets at varying distances. Then I bought a frame I liked that had thumb screw clips, breaking bands was not such a pain anymore. It came with a nice bandset made from good rubber. After that it was hard to go back to tubes. I started shooting short draw again. Buying pre made bandsets from ebay for less then I could buy tubes. Who cares if they break if I can just replace them in thirty seconds? But that did not last long. Short draw feels so limiting when I have been used to the power and speed of full butterfly draw. But tubes seemed to slow now. So I started making tapered butterfly bands with modern rubber, it's hard to go back now.....

So you like flats now? I was thinking about trying tubes but it just sounds like flats are better

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[Soske]

Yeah I shoot flats now, tube bandsets are easier to make and last longer, but don't have the speed and power of flats. Just depends on what your priorities are I guess

 

[mattwalt]

You tried shooting smaller ammo? I shoot 6mm mostly these days - and they're fast and flat shooting and accurate - esp. for stump-thumping or the odd shot while walking (assuming you're not hunting).

Also tying pseudo tapered tubes - say 1/3 length looped...

 

[Soske]

I have not tried smaller ammo. I want to keep my setup hunting ready. I like that the slingshot can be a practical hunting tool if need be. I have not killed anything with a slingshot yet. I just don't like to kill things if I don't need too. Aaaand of course I like to effect what I hit, I'm actually going to buy an 11mm lead mold and see how that goes

 

[mattwalt]

I used to think the same I do still keep a hunting setup - and even mould some 11mm lead. Using looped bands mean I can carry both setups - just simply change bands and go.

I have to be honest though I enjoy hunting - I'm not in it for simply killing stuff - I need good reason. And I just don't have that with my current lifestyle.

But over time I've stopped carrying a hunting setup and shoot 6mm way more (but also BB's - usually carry mainly those and some 6mm). I think 6mm is that point where weight and hitability seem to be optimised. Definitely give it a go.

 

[SLING-N-SHOT]

A rifle will shoot the same load faster than a pistol. The bullet is being pushed for a longer time down the longer barrel and the velocity increases as a result.

I think of a tapered band being like a rifle barrel. Instead of a hard snap like an un-tapered band or a tube, what you get instead is a constant acceleration as the different widths of the bands work to pull continuously throughout the shortening process.

Very well explained Winnie and makes perfect sense.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Henry the Hermit]

Tubes aren't THAT much slower. This video was with pseudo-tapered 2040. I later broke 400 fps, but neglected to record it.

 

[vince4242]

What Matt said ". I think 6mm is that point where weight and hitability seem to be optimised. Definitely give it a go." I definitely find 6 mm or quarter inch steel to have plenty of energy when hitting things and a very flat trajectory with a very light pool weight. BB's are fun to shoot but they don't have nearly enough energy to really make anything but a light spinner move... But you can carry a ton of them with you with absolutely no weight and the lightest band set and just have some fun in the woods.

cheers

 

[Soske]

Food for thought, I think I will get some 6mm steel and try that too. I have some
old tbg bands I had cut but found to light for my 9.5 mm lead. Maybe they would work for 6mm steel

 

[Soske]

I really like 2040 single tubes butterfly. would they be a good choice for 6mm steel? I would like to try pseudo tapers. The stiff 2040 tubes I have are to slippery to hold a loop. If I put a dab of super glue on the loop side maybe they would not slide, and hopefully not tear, which I found was the usual result when adding super glue to rubber. I also have a bunch of 1632 tubes